《财富》独家专访蚂蚁金服美国总裁

作为中国最大的第三方支付平台，支付宝正在获得本土以外市场的成长动力。目前使用该平台向美国商家购物的中国客户人数创下新纪录。

据支付宝统计，今年感恩节及其后的“黑色星期五”和“网购星期一”假日季，通过该平台在美国零售店购物的中国用户同比增长了足足7倍。同时，中国支付宝用户给美国商家带来的跨境销售额同比增幅达15倍。

支付宝的母公司蚂蚁金服集团脱胎于中国最大的电商阿里巴巴集团。支付宝现有4亿注册客户，几乎都是中国用户，他们通过该平台完成网购，或者在实体店购物。在美国与支付宝最为接近的对标企业，当属数字支付服务商PayPal。不过支付宝的用户数几乎是后者的3倍。

2014年，支付宝向梅西百货和第五大道等美国知名商家敞开了大门，这些商家开始接受支付宝提供的付款服务。从此，中国消费者可以更为便利地用自己的支付宝账户购买美国货。

和中国最繁忙的网购节日——每年11月11日的“双十一”相比，目前美国假日的销售额还是小巫见大巫。今年“双十一”期间，支付宝处理交易7.1亿笔，完成销售额143亿美元，相当于每秒处理8.59万笔交易。而据中国电子商务研究中心监测数据显示，2015年“感恩节+黑色星期五”两天时间内，美国消费者网上购物花费为44.5亿美元，仅为支付宝今年“双十一”业绩的零头。

支付宝最新一轮融资结束后估值达到了450亿美元，预计将于明年上市。

蚂蚁金服美国业务总裁Jingming Li说：“中国消费者是世界上最精明的买家之一，他们一直寻求购买国内难觅的美国等西方国家制造的产品。随着物流水平的提高，本地化支付选择的增加，中国消费者得以跨境购物。我们预计，中国海淘消费者激增的势头会持续整个假日购物季，在美国零售业电商提供更多折扣和促销时更会如此。”Li是一位硅谷资深人士，曾在Sun公司和网景担任过高级工程职位。

Alipay, the digital wallet of choice in China, is gaining traction beyond its geographic roots. A record number of Chinese are now using the service to shop with U.S. merchants.

The number of China-based Alipay users that shopped from U.S. retail sites over Thanksgiving, Black Friday and Cyber Monday increased 700% from last year, according Alipay. Meanwhile, total U.S. sales from China-based shoppers using Alipay increased 15 times versus last year.

Alipay, which is owned by Ant Financial, was originally created by Chinese e-commerce giant Alibaba. It has 400 million registered customers, virtually all Chinese, who use the service to buy products online, through their phones, and in stores.

The closest U.S. equivalent is digital payment service PayPal. But Alipay is almost triple the size.

In the past year, Alipay has opened its door to U.S. merchants like Macy’s and Saks Fifth Avenue accepting payments through its service. Doing so makes it easier for Chinese consumers to buy items using their Alipay accounts.

The U.S. holiday sales volume is small compared to the amount on China’s busiest online shopping day, known as Singles Day, on Nov. 11. This year Alipay processed $14.3 billion in sales by Alibaba. Overall, it, Alipay powered 710 million transactions including as many as 85,900 per second.

Alipay, which was recently valued at $45 billion after its latest funding round, is expected to go public in 2016.

“Among the savviest shoppers in the world, Chinese consumers are continuously seeking high quality U.S. products and Western merchandise that they can’t find in China,” said Jingming Li, president of Alipay U.S. “With better logistics and localized payment options now available to make cross-border purchases, we expect this tremendous growth of Chinese consumers to continue throughout the holiday season, particularly as U.S. e-commerce retailers provide more discounts and promotions.”

Li is a Silicon Valley veteran, having held senior engineering positions at Sun Microsystem and Netscape.

在阿里巴巴集团创始人马云看来，支付宝进入美国是打开国际市场的广泛行动的一部分。马云此前访问美国时曾谈到，希望帮助美国零售商和小企业解决向快速发展的中国中产阶级销售商品的问题。目前，中国中产阶级人数已相当于美国人口数量，预计在7年内还会增长一倍。

针对支付宝美国业务布局，《财富》杂志采访了蚂蚁金服美国业务总裁Jingming Li。他不仅谈论了支付宝在美国的计划，与Uber的合作，还谈及了支付宝独立上市的可能性。以下为采访摘要：

《财富》：支付宝是什么？

多数人将支付宝看做是数字生活的钱包。实际上，支付宝是帮助你做任何金融事情，包括在线购物、购买机票甚至支付电费的移动或网页应用。即使在线下，中国有些实体店也接受支付宝。可以说，支付宝并不是纯粹的金融工具，而是帮助方便生活的工具。

《财富》：支付宝与PayPal等其他数字钱包有何不同？

主要的不同点之一是重要性，如果你问10个人每天使用支付宝多少次，很少有人会说不用支付宝。有了支付宝你可以出门不带现金甚至银行卡，只要带手机就行。

《财富》：支付宝如何处理线下支付？

我们与NFC支付合作，我们在一些店使用专有技术，利用声音无线传输用户ID和支付信息，我们也使用条形码扫描验证用户。我想未来线上和线下支付方式会融合，在线支付和在实体店支付没有区别。支付宝将继续开发这种技术。

《财富》：目前使用支付宝的用户有多少？

我们有3.5亿注册用户，但我们是金融机构，注册用户不同于非金融机构，我们知道所有用户的ID，银行账户信息，相比其他支付公司，我们有更多重要的信息。

《财富》：你们如何在这么短的时间达到这种规模？

我们在技术上赶上了好时机，不需要太多基础设施，支付宝为中国消费者解决了一个难题。例如，在支付宝出现前，如果中国消费者想支付水电费，需要在银行排队，有了支付宝，他们用手机就可以付账。

《财富》：美国市场是否适合支付宝并取得快速增长？

我们看到中国消费者很想购买美国商品，我们看到支付宝有很大商机。现在美国处于商家一方，需求很大，或许某天会反过来，但现在不是。美国商家在生态系统中是非常重要的部分，去年我们让梅西百货和萨克斯第五大道上线，向中国消费者销售。

《财富》：你们与Uber中国的合作如何？

今年我们在中国也与Uber合作，这也成为Uber在中国获得成功的关键原因之一。

【针对此项合作，Uber公司的一位代表也向《财富》表示，“我们在中国取得显著增长，支付宝是这种成功的关键原因之一。”】

《财富》：支付宝如何成为Uber增长的推动力？

一旦你的应用或网站有支付宝支持，就代表有了信用，人们就会更愿意使用你的服务。这是获得客户的极大推动力，我们也有营销团队与他们合作发布广告。

《财富》：支付宝是否也支持Uber在中国的竞争对手？

这不是排外的协议。

《财富》：最近哪些美国零售商使用了支付宝？

Carter’s、Jewelry.com和Walgreen’s Skin Store。

《财富》：你们如何向美国品牌宣传？

几乎每个在线购物的中国消费者都是支付宝用户，这代表着巨大的商机。一两年后我们将有4亿用户。如果美国品牌有在线业务，就需要支付和物流支持，我们可以帮助他们。没有理由拒绝3.5亿用户，这比美国人口都多。

《财富》：你们如何防止支付欺诈？

任何支付系统安全都是最重要的，我们依赖自己的专有系统，我们的欺诈率很低。我们没有信用卡，只保存借记卡和银行账户，基本上是基于现金的电子系统。

《财富》：你们为什么让支付宝脱离阿里巴巴？

这是由于中国政府的相关规定。

《财富》：支付宝会成为上市公司么，什么时候上市？

当然，我想很可能上市，这不是秘密。至于什么时候我无可奉告。

《财富》：支付宝的收入来自哪里？

财务模式与其他支付公司很类似，我们对商家收费，某些消费者服务也不免费。上市后我们会发布这些信息，支付宝当前利润很高。(财富中文网)

译者：Pessy

校对：詹妮

Alipay’s push into the US is part of a broader effort by Alibaba’s founder, Jack Ma, to make inroads outside of China. During a trip to the US, Ma talked about how he wants to help US retailers and small businesses sell to the fast growing Chinese middle class, which is already equal in the size of the entire U.S. population and is expected to double in seven years.

Fortune sat down with Li to talk about Alipay’s US ambitions, the company’s partnership with taxi service Uber to accept payments through Alipay, and Alipay’s potential future as a public company.This interview was edited for length and clarity.

Fortune :What is Alipay?

Most people would refer to Alipay as a wallet for your digital life. It’s really a mobile or web app that helps you do everything you need to do financially including purchasing an item online, or buying a plane ticket online or even paying your electricity bill. And it even goes into offline, with physical stores in China able to accept Alipay. It’s not purely a financial tool, it’s designed to help your lifestyle.

How is it different from some of the other digital wallets out there such as PayPal?

One of the major differences is relevance. If you ask ten people how many times during the day you will use PayPal, I don’t know what the answer would be. But in China, it is very rare for anyone to say that they don’t use Alipay for anything in a given day. With Alipay, you could leave the house with just your cell phone and no cash or cards, and chances are you will survive.

How does Alipay approaches offline payments?

We work with NFC payments [NFC is a technology that lets people pay for an item using their phone by touching it to a reader at a the cash register]. We have some proprietary technologies in some stores that use sound to transfer user ID and payments information wirelessly. We also use barcode scanning to authenticate users.

I think in the future, there will be the convergence of payments both online and offline using mobile. There will be no difference in the way you pay online and in stores. Alipay will continue to work on this.

How many users does Alipay have?

We have 350 million registered users. But because we are a financial institution, our registered users are different from nonfinancial institutions. We know all of their IDs, their bank account information and have more substantive information than other payments companies.

You’ve achieved that scale in a relatively short amount of time, how?

We were at the right time in technology. There wasn’t a lot of infrastructure to begin with. Alipay really solved a problem for Chinese consumers. For example, before Alipay, if a Chinese consumer wanted to pay a utility bill, they would have to wait in line at a bank. With Alipay, they can pay the bills using their mobile phone.

How does the US market fit into Alipay and its growth?

We see the eagerness from Chinese consumers to buy American products. And we see a lot of value in allowing big and small U.S. businesses sell their products to Alipay members. Right now there is a lot of demand, and the US is on the merchant side of things. It can be visa versa someday, but not now. US merchants are a very important part of the ecosystem. Last year we brought on Macy’s and Saks Fifth Avenue to sell to Chinese consumers.

Tell me about the Uber China partnership

This year we also worked with Uber in China. And it is one of the key reasons why Uber is getting so successful in China.

[A representative for Uber issued this comment to Fortune on Uber’s partnership with Alipay: “We have seen phenomenal growth for Uber in China and Alipay is one of the key reasons for such a success.”]

How was Alipay a driver of growth for Uber?

Once you have Alipay in your app or website in China, it represents trust — meaning people will be more willing to use a service. It’s a great driver for customer acquisition. We also have our marketing team working with them as well to get the message out.

Does Alipay also power payments for any of Uber’s competitors in China?

It’s not an exclusive agreement.

Who are some of the recent US retailers that we would know that have now integrated Alipay as a payment mechanism?

Carter’s, Jewelry.com, and Walgreen’s Skin Store.

What’s your pitch to US brands?

Pretty much every Chinese consumer who wants to buy online is an Alipay member. And it represents a great opportunity. In a matter of a year or two, we will have 400 million users. If you have an online presence like Macy’s, it’s really about payments and logistics to be solved, which we help with. There’s no reason why you wouldn’t want to sell to 350 million members, which is bigger than the US population in general.

How do you prevent payments fraud?

A secure system is a fundamental necessity for any payment system. So we are relying on our own homegrown proprietary systems that have been tried and developed for the past 12 years. We have so much data from our consumers, including bank account information, cell phones, home address, so our fraud level is very low. Also, we don’t have credit cards, and users only link debit cards and banking accounts, basically making us an electronic cash based system. You can think of us a big, gigantic bank.

Why did you decide to make Alipay its own company separate from Alibaba?

It was due to Chinese government regulations.

Could ANT Financial, the operator of Alipay, be a public company and when will that happen?

Of course, I think there’s definitely potential to be a public company there, it’s no secret. I can’t comment on when that will happen.

Where does Alipay’s revenue come from?

Yeah, the financial model it is very similar to any other payment company. We charge fees to merchants. And certain consumer services are not free. As we become a public company we will release that information but Alipay is currently a very profitable business.